'Diálogo con lo Divino' | Sesión de Preguntas y Respuestas | Sadguru Sri Madhusudan Sai con la juventud
Pero entonces, seguí escuchando a mi conciencia interior. Seguía diciéndome: 'esto es lo que es; esto es lo que debes hacer'. No pude ignorarlo porque era muy alto y claro. Entonces, tenía que creer en esa conciencia Divina. Esto es lo que me dijeron desde el principio: diez años es esta fase, después de diez años no será así. Y siempre tuve la impresión de que, después de diez años, volvería a ser el mismo de siempre. Pero no sabía que esto era lo que estaba planeado para mí. Estos diez años fueron como la fase de transición en la que, cuando un hierro permanece demasiado cerca de un imán durante demasiado tiempo, se convierte en imán en sí mismo: se magnetiza. Esto es 'Transferencia de la Divinidad'. Hay nombres, formas, cosas que cambiarán porque ahora se está manifestando a través de otra forma y nombre con su propia personalidad.
Pregunta: ¿Dónde está Sri Sathya Sai Baba?
Sadguru Sri Madhusudan Sai – En primer lugar, aprendamos algunas cosas sobre Bhagavan Sri Sathya Sai Baba. Debe tener algunos de sus fundamentos correctos acerca de Él, Su personalidad y Su mismo propósito. Puedes sentir que la Conciencia Divina se manifiesta plena y totalmente solo a través de avatares a lo largo de las edades. Pero la verdad es que se está manifestando en todos nosotros, se está manifestando en la mesa, la silla y las flores. Pero hay instancias raras en el tiempo donde la conciencia Divina es capaz de manifestarse completamente, sin ninguna dilución, sin ninguna restricción, sin ninguna restricción—ese tipo de seres Divinos vienen una y otra vez y son llamados avatares. pūrṇa avatār es aquello que puede expresar esa conciencia Divina en toda su potencialidad y poder.
Entonces, de esta manera, 'esa' conciencia Divina tomó una forma, tomó la forma más hermosa y encantadora, a saber, Bhagavan Sri Sathya Sai Baba: fácil de trabajar, de hablar, de estar con él y de amar; para que pudiera atraer a la gente hacia la gran idea de la espiritualidad. Entonces, deben recordar que es la conciencia Divina la que se manifiesta como una personalidad en esta tierra para una misión o causa particular. Muchas veces lo vemos al revés: decimos: "Rama es Dios". Pero no decimos "Dios es Rama". Decimos "Krishna es Dios" porque conocemos a Krishna y no conocemos a Dios. Entonces, no decimos "Dios es Krishna". Todo es relativo. De manera similar, la mayoría de nosotros seguía diciendo "Bhagavan Sri Sathya Sai Baba es Dios", lo cual es cierto. Pero la verdad más grande, la verdad real es que 'Dios es Bhagavan Sri Sathya Sai Baba'. Dios fue, es y será. Este es el vedanta supremo.
En segundo lugar, cuando la conciencia Divina se manifestó como una persona, como un gurú, como una guía, como Dios, nos guió, nos llevó por el camino correcto. Así comenzó el viaje. Pero en algún lugar como dice Confucio, cuando el discípulo está listo, aparece el gurú. Cuando el discípulo está realmente listo, el gurú desaparece. Entonces, en algún momento, no podríamos haber seguido con esta idea de que, porque nos lo dicen, lo estamos haciendo, porque se nos ha pedido que hagamos, y lo estamos haciendo, de lo contrario, no lo haríamos. haber hecho algo Entonces, allí comenzó la transición. Creo que alrededor de guru purnima 2019, ocurrió la verdadera transición, cuando en realidad no estaba realmente listo. Al principio nunca estaba lista para nada. Siempre he sido, en cierto modo, empujado a lo siguiente, sin darme cuenta. De hecho, tuve que ir con él. Nos hemos comprometido con nuestro objetivo. Por eso digo que gurudakṣiṇā no significa ir y ofrecer flores en el samādhi. gurudakṣiṇā significa reverenciar la palabra del guru. Así empezó. Y a medida que pasaba el tiempo, se hacía más y más obvio que uno tiene que depender de la conciencia Divina porque ese es el verdadero propósito. Y así fue como se hizo el entrenamiento. Lentamente también debes comenzar a depender de tu conciencia Divina.
Y entonces sabrás que siempre fue validado por la Presencia. Pero lentamente la Presencia comenzó a fundirse en la conciencia. Entonces, ¿cómo comprendemos este fenómeno ahora? Cuando cambias el agua de un recipiente a otro, se ve diferente (desde un vaso azul pasa a un vaso amarillo), pero el agua es la misma. Cuando bebes el agua, sabes que es lo mismo. De manera similar, aquellos que conocen a Bhagavan Sri Sathya Sai Baba, naturalmente se relacionan con Dios a través de Él. Aquellos que conocen a Jesús, (hoy es Viernes Santo), se relacionan con Dios de esa manera, para ellos Jesús es Dios. Al final, la pregunta es qué es Dios; como dije, la conciencia Divina en el nivel vedanta es el Amor Supremo Desinteresado. Entonces, cuando ocurrió la transición, definitivamente me sentí muy nervioso, en cierto modo me sentí perdido, con muchas preguntas. Sabía que se harían muchas preguntas, surgirían muchas dudas, que no eran nuevas para mí. Siempre surgieron innumerables preguntas y dudas, pero esa vez fue fácil porque simplemente seguí ciegamente; entonces, había alguien a quien seguir. Pero ahora, de repente no vi ninguno frente a mí. Me sentí como un niño perdido en un lugar nuevo.
TRADUCCION NO OFICIAL
'Dialogue with the Divine' | Questions and Answers Session | Sadguru Sri Madhusudan Sai with the Youth
Question: Where is Sri Sathya Sai Baba?
Sadguru Sri Madhusudan Sai – Firstly, let us learn a few things about Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba. You should get some of your fundamentals right about Him, His personality and His very purpose. You may feel that the Divine Consciousness manifests itself fully and totally only through avatārs over the ages. But the truth is that it is manifesting in all of us—it is manifesting in the table, chair, and flowers. But there are rare instances in time where the Divine consciousness is capable of manifesting itself fully, without any dilution, without any restriction, without any restraint—those kinds of Divine beings come time and again and they are called avatārs. pūrṇa avatār is that which can express that Divine consciousness in all its potentiality and power.
So, in this way, 'that' Divine consciousness took a form, took the most beautiful, and charming form namely Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba—easy to work with, talk to, easy to be with, and easy to love; so that He could attract people towards the great idea of spirituality. So, you must remember that it is Divine consciousness which manifests as a personality on this earth for a particular mission or cause. Many times, we see it the other way round—we say, "Rama is God." But we don't say "God is Rama." We say "Krishna is God" because we know Krishna, and we don't know God. So, we don't say "God is Krishna." It is all relative. Similarly, most of us kept on saying "Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba is God", which is true. But the bigger truth, the real truth is that 'God is Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba.' God was, is and will be. This is the ultimate vedānta.
Secondly, when the Divine consciousness manifested as a persona, as a guru, as a guide, as God—it guided us, it took us on the right path. This is how the journey began. But somewhere as Confucius says, when the disciple is ready, the guru appears. When the disciple is truly ready, the guru disappears. So, at some point in time, we could not have been going on with this idea that, because we are being told so, we are doing—because we have been asked to do, so we are doing— otherwise, we wouldn't have done anything. So, there the transition started. I think around guru purnima 2019, the real transition happened, when I was actually not really ready. Initially I was never ready for anything. I have always been, in a way, pushed into the next thing, without being aware. In fact, I had to go with it. We have committed ourselves to our goal. That is why I say, gurudakṣiṇā does not mean going and offering flowers at the samādhi. gurudakṣiṇā means to revere the word of the guru. That is how it started. And as the time passed, it was becoming more and more obvious that one has to depend on the Divine consciousness because that is the true purpose. And that is how the training was done. Slowly you must also start depending on your Divine consciousness.
And then you will know that it was always validated by the Presence. But slowly the Presence started merging in the consciousness. So, how do we comprehend this phenomenon now? When you shift water from one vessel to another, it looks different—from blue glass it goes into a yellow glass—but the water is the same. When you drink the water, you know it is the same. Similarly, those who know Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba, have naturally related to God through Him. Those who know Jesus, (today is Good Friday), they relate to God that way—for them Jesus is God. At the end what is God is the question—as I said, the Divine consciousness at the vedānta level is Supreme Selfless Love. So, when the transition happened, I definitely felt very unnerved, in a way I felt lost, with a lot of questions. I knew a lot of questions would be asked, a lot of doubts would be raised, which weren't new to me. There were always umpteen questions and doubts that were raised, but that time it was easy because I just followed blindly—then, there was somebody to follow. But now, suddenly I saw none in front of me. I felt like a child lost in a new place.
But then, I kept listening to my inner conscience. It kept telling me – 'this is what it is; this is what you must do.' I couldn't ignore it because it was so loud and clear. So, I had to just believe in that Divine consciousness. This is what I was told right at the beginning—ten years is this phase, after ten years it won't be so. And I was always under the impression that, after ten years I will go back to being my usual self. But I did not know that this is what was being planned for me. These ten years were like the transition phase where, when an iron remains too close to a magnet for too long, it becomes magnet itself—it gets magnetised. This is 'Divinity Transferring.' There are names, ways, things that will change because it is now manifesting through another form and name with its own personalities. To that extent it is different and to that extent it is the same. But as I said, if you taste you would know. By looking at it you will not know. You have to taste it. Tasting it means, you really work closely, trying to understand and not come with pre-conditioned minds. When we come with conditions, we lose God. If we come unconditionally; we find God just with a snap of a finger.
It was a difficult experience in the beginning, but now I know this is how it was supposed to be. You surrender to that Divine, it takes over, it does what it wants to do through you and you don't come in between, which means you don't let your mind come in the way. This is the destiny for all of us, sooner or later. Be prepared! I am not saying you all can claim that it is Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba who got inside you, for these are all just a way to explain things. It is actually the Divine consciousness which suddenly awakens within you, and then it starts doing what it needs to do. The personality of Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba is only a catalyst to bring about this change. Catalyst does nothing—it just starts the reaction; helps you complete the reaction and gets out of the reaction without being changed at all. God is like that; Divinity is like that. It is the catalyst which actually invokes your own inner Divinity to do what needs to be done. To that extent, it is the same, to that extent, it is different. Is this clear? – Ponder over it!
Sadguru Sri Madhusudan Sai – Firstly, let us learn a few things about Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba. You should get some of your fundamentals right about Him, His personality and His very purpose. You may feel that the Divine Consciousness manifests itself fully and totally only through avatārs over the ages. But the truth is that it is manifesting in all of us—it is manifesting in the table, chair, and flowers. But there are rare instances in time where the Divine consciousness is capable of manifesting itself fully, without any dilution, without any restriction, without any restraint—those kinds of Divine beings come time and again and they are called avatārs. pūrṇa avatār is that which can express that Divine consciousness in all its potentiality and power.
So, in this way, 'that' Divine consciousness took a form, took the most beautiful, and charming form namely Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba—easy to work with, talk to, easy to be with, and easy to love; so that He could attract people towards the great idea of spirituality. So, you must remember that it is Divine consciousness which manifests as a personality on this earth for a particular mission or cause. Many times, we see it the other way round—we say, "Rama is God." But we don't say "God is Rama." We say "Krishna is God" because we know Krishna, and we don't know God. So, we don't say "God is Krishna." It is all relative. Similarly, most of us kept on saying "Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba is God", which is true. But the bigger truth, the real truth is that 'God is Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba.' God was, is and will be. This is the ultimate vedānta.
Secondly, when the Divine consciousness manifested as a persona, as a guru, as a guide, as God—it guided us, it took us on the right path. This is how the journey began. But somewhere as Confucius says, when the disciple is ready, the guru appears. When the disciple is truly ready, the guru disappears. So, at some point in time, we could not have been going on with this idea that, because we are being told so, we are doing—because we have been asked to do, so we are doing— otherwise, we wouldn't have done anything. So, there the transition started. I think around guru purnima 2019, the real transition happened, when I was actually not really ready. Initially I was never ready for anything. I have always been, in a way, pushed into the next thing, without being aware. In fact, I had to go with it. We have committed ourselves to our goal. That is why I say, gurudakṣiṇā does not mean going and offering flowers at the samādhi. gurudakṣiṇā means to revere the word of the guru. That is how it started. And as the time passed, it was becoming more and more obvious that one has to depend on the Divine consciousness because that is the true purpose. And that is how the training was done. Slowly you must also start depending on your Divine consciousness.
And then you will know that it was always validated by the Presence. But slowly the Presence started merging in the consciousness. So, how do we comprehend this phenomenon now? When you shift water from one vessel to another, it looks different—from blue glass it goes into a yellow glass—but the water is the same. When you drink the water, you know it is the same. Similarly, those who know Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba, have naturally related to God through Him. Those who know Jesus, (today is Good Friday), they relate to God that way—for them Jesus is God. At the end what is God is the question—as I said, the Divine consciousness at the vedānta level is Supreme Selfless Love. So, when the transition happened, I definitely felt very unnerved, in a way I felt lost, with a lot of questions. I knew a lot of questions would be asked, a lot of doubts would be raised, which weren't new to me. There were always umpteen questions and doubts that were raised, but that time it was easy because I just followed blindly—then, there was somebody to follow. But now, suddenly I saw none in front of me. I felt like a child lost in a new place.
But then, I kept listening to my inner conscience. It kept telling me – 'this is what it is; this is what you must do.' I couldn't ignore it because it was so loud and clear. So, I had to just believe in that Divine consciousness. This is what I was told right at the beginning—ten years is this phase, after ten years it won't be so. And I was always under the impression that, after ten years I will go back to being my usual self. But I did not know that this is what was being planned for me. These ten years were like the transition phase where, when an iron remains too close to a magnet for too long, it becomes magnet itself—it gets magnetised. This is 'Divinity Transferring.' There are names, ways, things that will change because it is now manifesting through another form and name with its own personalities. To that extent it is different and to that extent it is the same. But as I said, if you taste you would know. By looking at it you will not know. You have to taste it. Tasting it means, you really work closely, trying to understand and not come with pre-conditioned minds. When we come with conditions, we lose God. If we come unconditionally; we find God just with a snap of a finger.
It was a difficult experience in the beginning, but now I know this is how it was supposed to be. You surrender to that Divine, it takes over, it does what it wants to do through you and you don't come in between, which means you don't let your mind come in the way. This is the destiny for all of us, sooner or later. Be prepared! I am not saying you all can claim that it is Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba who got inside you, for these are all just a way to explain things. It is actually the Divine consciousness which suddenly awakens within you, and then it starts doing what it needs to do. The personality of Bhagawan Sri Sathya Sai Baba is only a catalyst to bring about this change. Catalyst does nothing—it just starts the reaction; helps you complete the reaction and gets out of the reaction without being changed at all. God is like that; Divinity is like that. It is the catalyst which actually invokes your own inner Divinity to do what needs to be done. To that extent, it is the same, to that extent, it is different. Is this clear? – Ponder over it!
